Band In a Box

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 8 Jun 2007 11:07 am

problem-1. When band in a Box says it is playing in the Key of C, it is NOT, it is playing a whole tone lower in Bb, even tho the chords show in C.?????
What can I do to correct this???

I can set it to D and play my guitar in C and that works. But the chords now show in D on the screen.

Another problem-2. How do I change a song all on one track, on BIAB, with MGX extension, to one with BIAB melody and instrumets on diffferent tracks
, with a MGU Extension. Any help and advice on lthis would be appreciated. Thanks....al.

:)

Darvin Willhoite · Post by **Darvin Willhoite** » 8 Jun 2007 2:53 pm

Can't help you with the second question, but the first one I can. Just determine what key the song is really playing in, and click the transpose box and change it to the correct key. When it asks if you want to change the chords, click NO. I've had to do this on lots of songs. (I'm not at my BIAB computer right now, so I'm not sure how the question is worded, but you can figure it out from there).

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 8 Jun 2007 3:59 pm

Darvin-I tried that and thanks for the suggestion. It doesnt matter which key or anthing it all PLAYs one tone lower than the key indicated. And the steel has to play in the real key of Bb when the bibox says C , if I transpose to D then the sound is in C but the chords are in D. Weird....al

Alan Kirk · Post by **Alan Kirk** » 8 Jun 2007 4:06 pm

I wonder if there could be a setting for your sound card that is doing this transposition. Do you other MIDI programs work okay?

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 9 Jun 2007 4:01 am

Al, something that might help, On the bar at the top click GM. Under that click Master Tune. There is a test there to see if your sound card supports Master tune. Also there is a button for resetting A to 440. That may work, but it sounds like it is set for a Bb instrument like a clarinet or something. There is a way to set that but I can't remember what it is right now. If Master tuning doesn't help let me know and I'll do some more research. Good luck.

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 9 Jun 2007 4:34 am

The second part of your question, when you play the MGX file, see if the box with the style has an X in front of the style name. If it does, the style is disabled, right click the box and click "Style is enabled". That should solve that problem, I think.

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 9 Jun 2007 4:54 am

"The key transpose box on the main screen of Band-in-a-Box sets MIDI music you hear and the Notation key for viewing and printing at the same time. The 'Transpose' settings in the Notation Window Options dialog affect only the viewable and printable notes, while leaving the MIDI playback in the original key. This allows you to view proper notation for non-concert instruments, such as a tenor sax. Open the Notation Window and press the [OPT] button to open the Notation Window Options dialog. Beside 'Transpose', type in the number of semitones that you want the notation to be transposed. For example, if you have a trumpet, set it to +2. There are also some presets that you can select from the pull-down menu that may work for your instrument."

Al, this is from the FAQs at PGMusic site. There may be something there that will help, I hope so.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 9 Jun 2007 8:51 am

Alan and Howard- thanks for your info. I tried and checked all of your suggestions , tried setting to Factoruy Defaults and everything, it still does not do all the songs right , that is play the song in the key indicated and show the chords in the key indicated at the same time.

I would ask George Wixon, BIAB Guru, but he is recovering from a heart attack and I don't want to bother him. Next thing to do is Email PG Music and see what they say. Thanks for all your help...al.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 9 Jun 2007 7:51 pm

Howard Tate wrote:Al, something that might help, On the bar at the top click GM. Under that click Master Tune. There is a test there to see if your sound card supports Master tune. Also there is a button for resetting A to 440. That may work, but it sounds like it is set for a Bb instrument like a clarinet or something. There is a way to set that but I can't remember what it is right now. If Master tuning doesn't help let me know and I'll do some more research. Good luck.

Howard , you might have something there, try and remember what it is. I tried the master tuning A 440 is G not A. I tried to go + to correct but it just says A440 and the tone is still 2 half tones lower, ,,,G........should be A. that is the problem

Here is one problem. I do a backup bb in C. The chords on the screen are in C.....here is the fun part, it playes fine...in...Bb. of course I can put the key in D and it will play in C with the chords in D.
The thing is while I am playing this, I usuually change some chords to suit me, and I dont want to spend time my time doing a lot of transposing. ...thanks ...al.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 9 Jun 2007 7:56 pm

Howard-I even emailed PG support and they didn't mention resetting the A440. and now I see that is the problem. Try and remember how I can reset the A440 to sound A again instead of G....thanks...al

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 10 Jun 2007 5:35 am

I'll try to find something Al, in the meantime, what is your sound card and what are you playing back through? What version of BIAB are you using.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 10 Jun 2007 8:47 am

Howard-I found that the Master Tone is not correct. It is supposed to be A-440 instead it is G.....

I have Windows Media Edition XP and Band in a Box 2007. I dont know the sound card. I have Real-Tek in there for one thing.

So now I have to find out how to change that a whole tone up to A. .....thanks again.....al.

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 10 Jun 2007 9:36 am

One more thing to check, if you haven't already. Open "Options" at the top, go to "Transpose". Every thing should be at 0. Select "Default" and see if that helps. Also open the Tuner Icon and see if that says A=440. I've been beta testing BIAB since the early versions, but I don't remember running into this problem before. I'll keep looking for an answer.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 10 Jun 2007 9:46 am

I didn't notice the sound module in use,
but it's possible the SYNTH is set
into a transpose mode globally.

Something to look at.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 10 Jun 2007 1:35 pm

Howard-I did all that you suggested and checked it says A 440, but the A is a true G. Now I have to got from G to A440. ????

David-Sounds like you might be onto something. But I dont understand your Technical talk. What do you mean by Globally and synth set.Everything works fine EXCEPT when I play the steel in A, the Biab backup is playing in G. So I need to to bump up the master sound up one whole tone to A440....weird...al.

:)

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 10 Jun 2007 7:39 pm

Al, synths or synth software 'listen and talk' to
your sequencer, BiaB,
with MIDI computer language.

Each keyboard message is basically:
Note # (1-123 typically),
On/Off,
velocity on / velocity off
and things like pitch bend info
and modulation (like a waver/ocilation,
chorus or warble etc)

Ok, if your sequencer sends out and A note it is sending a specific
Note Number that corresponds to a 'standard' in GM, General Midi.
2nd octave A = #xxx
3rd Octave C# = #xxx
4th octave B = #xxx etc.

Midi can make a synth sound well BEYOND the range
of the actualy keyboard on a smaller synth.

OK In the MIDI section of the SYNTH,
it can say take OCTAVE 2 and play
Octave 3, or octave 1, instead of 2.

It can ALSO displace or transpose an A note to
another note such as the G you are getting.
So if you have a midi file in C and you want Bb,
your synth can be instructed to transpose to another
pitch.

The sequencer still thinks it's in C
but the NOTE messages are sent to Bb.

There maybe some dialog in the synth's
or software synth's setup
that is inadvertyently switched to
drop a whole tone, from C to Bb.

(They USUALLY do this from C as a reference.)

Hope this helps.
DD

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 10 Jun 2007 7:56 pm

David-Looks like you really know your stuff. I think I understand it though the way you explained it.

That is probably the problem, But I have no way of knowing how to address the software Synth.I looked through all the options and found I could only change the master tone + or - 1 semitone. Not enough there. I need a whole tone. Thanks for your response...al.

:)

b0b · Post by **b0b** » 10 Jun 2007 9:12 pm

I'm looking at the Mac version of BIAB, but the Windows version is probably similar.

In the MIDI menu, there's an option called "MIDI Settings...". It brings up a window that includes an option for "Concert Pitch Adjust". It was set to 0 on my computer. If I set it to -2, I get exactly the symptom you describe: a song in C sounds like it's in Bb.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 10 Jun 2007 10:54 pm

Al glad to have been of some help.

b0b's idea might be on the money too.
Or if it is not adjusted incorerectly,
it CAN be used as a work around to compensate.
Maybe easier that trying to decifer the synth settings.

Not knowing what software synth you have
AND having an example in front of me,
I can only talk in generalities typical
in MOST systems.

Good luck.
And I applaud anyone of your generation
wading into the murk waters of computer sound systems.
DEFINITELY takes some spunk and willingness
to embrace the strange uncharted waters!

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 11 Jun 2007 11:15 am

A setting I forgot, similiar to what b0b said. Under Options> preferences, click Arrange and see if concert pitch is set to 0. That may be it.

Robert Leaman · Post by **Robert Leaman** » 11 Jun 2007 4:39 pm

Here is something that you might try. Since BIAB 2005 I think, there is an option for transposing instruments. For example, trumpet music is written up 2 semitones so that when a trumpet sees C it actually plays a Bb. There are preset tranposition options in BIAB to set this. Go to the Opt. Menu and select Preferences and when that window opens, select Notation. There you can see a selection called Transpose Options. Make certain that (any) is displayed and then choose Defaults. The Transpose setting needs to be set at zero(0). This might solve the problem.

In any event, you can see the Notation Options by going to Help and type in Notation- Options Dialog Box. The window shows what options are available for notation.In addition, if you have a printed manual, see page 113.

For those interested, I have collection of more than 10,000 BIAB files and Midi files. A PM will get you information for cost of a CD.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 11 Jun 2007 7:53 pm

Hi all you guys that helped me. I used your ideas to poke around and found the way to do it.--

Opt-Preferences-Practice-and CONCERT did it!

I dont know why I hit practice, but I tried transpose, arrange, notation, etc. so I figured why not.

I ask George Wixon by email, he is doing fine with his recovery from his heart attack, he gave me some pointers, one was to change a song MGX all on on track to split MGU with the melody separate, so I can mute the melody and still get the backup.

I knew the Forum wouldn't let me down. Thanks to you all.I appreciate it.....al.

:):)

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 12 Jun 2007 3:01 am

Glad you got it Al, sorry I missed it about the practice option. The older I get the worse my memory is. As to the MGX problem, as I said earlier you probably just have to enable the style.

Al Marcus · Post by **Al Marcus** » 12 Jun 2007 8:32 am

Howard-I got the MGX to split melody off , so I can mute the melody and keep the backup playing. And you are right I cliked right on style enabled. That did it.
Thanks again.....al.

:):)

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 12 Jun 2007 8:36 am

Gld your up and running.

How bout letting us hear some of your current playing?
Always great to hear a master at work.

The Steel Guitar Forum

Band In a Box

Band In a Box

Transpose Options

Concert Pitch for BIAB